MTL:

The feds help to fund these signals because they have been documented to improve traffic flow and motorist safety. Independent studies by U of M, MSU and the University of Detroit Mercy have documented these benefits. Please see the FAST-TRAC page of the Road Commission for Oakland County (RCOC) Web site for more informaiton. Not sure how you conclude that "everyone" agrees. Have you done scientific studies of driver response? Have you done studies of actual traffic flow and crash history? These universities have done such studies. Check out the FAST-TRAC page on the Road Commission's Web site for more information: http://www.rcocweb.org/Commuters/FAST-TRAC.aspx

- Road Commission for Oakland County

Well finally at least someone can direct me to these studies...I will look at them, but right now I just wanted to respond to your post...why wouldn't the city council respond to my accusations with evidence? (I don't expect you to know that either) Of course everyone doesn't agree, but I may be allowed to use hyperbole when the plurality of commentors on this site agree, which is evident by all of the "timing" posts.

MTL:

Some (many?) of the timing issues raised on this site refer to traditional "fixed-time" traffic signals. One of the benefits of the "smart" signals is that they automatically readjust their continuously in real time to best address the traffic that is present. The traditional fixed-time signals are adjusted every 5 to 10 years, when the Road Commission is able to conduct a traffic study to determine current traffic patterns (or when there is a malfunction, which is typically when the reports are filed here).

That's not to say there are never problems with the smart signals. One of the most common problems we have is that the phone lines that we rely on for communications between the computer at the intersection and the regional computer will go down. Getting the phone company to repair the lines is often a time consuming process, and the signals fall back into a fixed-time mode until the communications can be fixed. We are working on converting some of the signals to wireless communications to avoid this problem, but that requires funding.
Nonetheless, we are convinced that our smart signals are saving a considerable amount of time for motorists by generallly ensuring that the intersections equipped with the technology are as efficient as possible.

By the way, the best way to report a problem with any traffic signal, and ensure the fastest response possible from the Road Commission is to contact us directly. We are not able to regularly monitor this Web site or the numerous other sites at which people can post concerns. We can be reached toll free at 877-858-4804 or via our Website, www.rcocweb.org (click on "contact us").

Thanks,
Road Commission for Oakland County

RCOC:
this link you provide "U of M FAST-TRAC studies" leads to a page that can not be found...the "ITS America" link did show me that Mike Rogers is probably the one benefiting the most from ITS, and lots of research here. I searched "Oakland County MI" and found no pertinent documents. In fact it would probably just be simpler if you could just provide a list of the reference documents that were used to persuade RCOC to begin using these systems back in the late 80's early 90's. I imagine there was a trial period and a follow up study was done and the name of that study would also be helpful. I know somebody told you those universities did those studies but how do they define success? I have been driving through these systems since 1992 and my personal observation is they are not working in the manner we were told they would work...at it's best the system does no better than timed lights. Now Macomb county is going to them and they have already created a mess on Mound and 15 mile roads. What I want to see is proof that moving from any point "A" to any point "B" through a traffic management system takes less time while being safe relative to making the same trip with a strictly timed system of traffic control.

So we are disagreeing about the definition of many...I will restate this....in the city of Troy on the interactive web map for seeclickfix...there are 13 complaints for traffic light timing...Troy has the traffic controls at every major intersection and many non major intersections...we could disagree about what is major and what is non major my point is there is enough complaints about timing at controlled intersections to warrant calling those types of complaints common

MTL:

Since we cannot attach files to these responses, I cannot attach the U of M and MSU studies referenced below (note we did not say the studies were at the link, but that additional information about the FAST-TRAC system was at the link). However, if you contact RCOC via our Web site (www.rcocweb.org -- click on "contact us") or by phone, toll-free at 877-858-4804, we can provide the studies to you.
Road Commission for Oakland County

We don't disagree that there are occasional problems with the system. However, we also recognize that these intersections carry hundreds of thousands of cars each day. 13 people is one very, very tiny percentage of the total users of the system. Also, your assumption is that the roads would be better without the system. We discagree. Some of the roads in Troy are simply over capacity during rush hours. Eliminating FAST-TRAC would certainly not help that situation and, we believe it would make the situation worse. Help resolve this with a comment, image or video...

True 13 is a small number but those 13 in one city in Oakland County represent hundreds if not thousands that are frustrated every day but are unaware or otherwise unable to make contact with the RCOC either through this venue or the RCOC web site. I don't disagree that I am making assumptions and that over the 20 years I have been driving in this area it has been developing rapidly, but population is beginning to decline. I would like the studies to see if my assumptions have any foundation. It may be possible that the system is more successful than fixed timing by some metric that I don't find pragmatic or useful, I can definitely understand how it facilitates measuring traffic and responding to problems more quickly but I don't think that is as important. Did the study consider that drivers get used to fix timing and adjust their driving habits to maximize their commute? I am grateful for your responses and have sent in my request for the FAST-TRAC studies through the RCOC web site.

I've read the studies on the Orchard Lake Corridor, South Lyon and Troy accidents. In my opinion the studies do not definitively conclude that SCATS is any better or worse than fixed timing. SCATS showed improvement for traffic moving opposite the major flow during peak times on arterial streets but insignificant improvement moving on those same streets with the major flow, and the authors of the study even caution that there is considerable error because the optical equipment used to count vehicles was missing cars and it got worse as traffic volume increased, which would explain the minimal improvement in percentages. Flow on minor approaches was outright worse during peak hours. Delays for left turn vehicles were unchanged and accidents were unchanged as a result of SCATS. In my opinion this subject is extremely difficult to measure...there are way too many variables to accurately determine if this system is working or not. I would say this is all water under the bridge now and the RCOC should not commit any more money to this until objective improvements can be demonstrated on this system

I have sat for nearly 10 minutes and nearly late to work because of the light on Maple at Chicago Road. The light for the left turn is a solid red when there's clearly no traffic the light should be blinking red. This is absurd and I want to notify someone so it can be changed immediately!! I should not have to wait when there's no traffic and be late to work !!

Everytime I drive through troy I get stopped at what seems like every traffic light. This is due to poorly timed lights. This is lowering my gas milage which is causing damage to the environment. This is causing unnecessary wear and tear on my vehicle. Whomever is responsible for traffic lights in troy needs to be immediately fired/let the townfolk throw rocks at him/her.

I dont know anything about timing traffic lights, but I KNOW I could do better than this.. really stressful system I cant believe these "people" have the audacity to accept out tax dollars with this garbage system they have in place to serve US THE TAXPAYERS FIX THE TRAFFIC LIGHTS.